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 DDM 2.0 News!!!!!

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ZER0
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PostSubject: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 1:03 pm

I'm a little worried, it's starting to sound weird. Somebody hold me.....

Desert of Desolation
Monsters and Heroes both familiar and new: Gelatinous Cube
Re-concepted creatures from early 4th edition art: The troll, for example, will have the 4th edition look.
Mount creatures for the DDM game: Mounts can accept certain types of riders. Riders don't actually go on the mini; instead you set the rider on the stat card to indicate who the rider is riding. Mounts give special abilities to the rider. New mount rules on the booster insert, with online support (if necessary. (From Guy: The mount rules are already really technically solid, IMO. I got to review them a few months ago.)
Every monster in the set except one is going to be appearing in the first 4th Ed Monster Manual. (Barring the pc types, of course.)
Pictures shown of Umber Hulk, Mummy, Gelatinous Cube.


Aside: The code name for 4th edition might have potentially been Project Viper (Andy's evil mastermind brain child), but it was actually called Orcus. Orcus is on the cover of the new monster manual. Orcus is also sort of the mascot of 4th edition.


D&D Minis Game will be re-launched in April 2008. It will look a little different from the game we know today. But it will still feel like the DDM game we know today. They want the DDM game to be as close to the D&D combat experience as they can. They want DDM to be an extension of D&D combat.


Some of the different rules for DDM:


- These attempt to remove the barriers to entry from the D&D game.


- There are no command or morale rules in the new edition.


- Instead, there are special abilities creatures have that make them much better at taking out enemies that are at half damage, and things like that.


- The concept of commanders becomes "Champions:" These are the special creatures that have special abilities they can use a few times per game to really help their warband. These are the creatures that you can build warbands around, but you no longer need to check whether creatures are in command, etc.



- Faction system changes: Current DDM makes it challenge for R&D to give interesting minis to LG, for example. The new faction system is more like this: borderlands, civilization, the wild, underdark. Every creature hails from at least one, but probably two factions. Dwarf Caver might be from civilized and underdark. They also have keywords for Good & Evil, and your warband can't contain both Good & Evil creatures together. Sort of a two-tiered faction system. It takes more to have the Good & Evil keywords than it does today. Only the creatures who are "Capital E Evil" will have the Evil keyword. There is a lot of variety in warband constructions.

Well, I'm still going to try it, but it's not what I thought. Sounds fun. And for everyone who's not, *we're getting our G-CUBE!!*

Updated info on DoD2:

April: DDM Starter game
- $14.95
- 5 fixed minis in clear plastic clamshell: Young Green Dragon, Yuan-Ti, Dwarf Battlemaster, Human Sellsword, Elf Warlock.
- These minis are not included in the dungeon of dread set.
- It's set up as a starter game so the creatures are relatively balanced against each other (possibly a group vs. one dragon).
- Two double-sided maps. One side of one map is split into two maps for smaller battles. (Including the starter/learning battle.)
- Quick Start rules
- New Rulebook: A little less Byzantine
- Reorganization of the cards: Clearer with trigger conditions, amount of action


In 4th Ed: A Young Green Dragon is Large.


April 2008: Dungeons of Dread set
Showed booster picture with Beholder (matches the Beholder statue picture above); Four armed skeleton; Some kind of flaming (or icy) dude with a big hammer.


Legacy Support for DDM 2.0:
Designing DDM 2.0 stat cards for every set coming out this year. Free downloadable cards to print & use.
Also support for the All Stars set: 60 minis that the skirmish players want to see in the new game, which will be drawn from the first 11 sets. Steve anticipates many of the minis we're playing with right now. A lot of the stuff you might have bought on eBay the last few months are likely to be supported.
Potentially willing to make/sell hard copies of the legacy support cards depending on demand.


Going to be able to start playing DDM 2.0 soon:
D&D Insider will have new stat cards for Desert of Des.
Online Rulebook
Stat Card Downloads
Launch Tournament at DD XP next feburary. (Tentatively planned, so no promises.)
Sneak Peek of a stat card at D&D Game day Nov 3rd. There will actually be a current stat card and a 4th Edition stat card. (Well, they're not sure. Details are hazy.)



Pictures of minis of the new Troll from Desert of Desolation, plus the armored fire elemental-like creature.
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 2:39 pm

Also, the Q&A with R&D for D&D Minis:

Q: Please give us Greyhawk minis: Igglwyv (spelling?), Rary, etc.

Q: Will there be re-balancing of All Star stats for the new game:
A: They will have to be, because the stats & system has changed. The goal is to give you *playable* *competitive* minis. For example, a Storm Silverhand mage band will still be playable, even though the stats will be slightly different. The point costs on the new cards won't necessarily match the point costs on the bases of the All Star minis. (Though the overall scale of point costing is basically the same. But there are some changes such that low cost minis will be better able to fight higher-cost minis.)

Q: (Question I couldn't hear.)
A: There will be 200 point and 500 point play.

Q: Will there be a Magic Online like mechanism?
A: Right now the online miniatures are different than the ones they're putting in the boxes. The online minis are for the virtual tabletop. You will get a selection of virtual minis as part of your subscription. (I think that last sentence is right, but may not be.)

Q: For competitive players, we end up with lots of redundant minis that we don't use. Will there be support for mass battles rules so we can make use of those?
A: No plans for that. But Rob asked how many people played the mass battles rules. Rob agrees it would be fun to play with those redundant minis in the game; this is a job for a designer in the future.

Q: Balancing? How much effort is being given to promoting synergies.
A: They're making sure champion powers are things you'd want to build warbands around. But there will always be some figures that just prove to be stronger than others, but they're working hard to make sure things like champion abilities play a strong role in the game. They design some obvious combos, as well as more subtle synergies, and they also end up with some unanticipated synergies. If you can put in enough information density and interesting hooks, those synergies end up manufacturing themselves as the pool of minis increases.

Q: For tabletop, will we ever be able to buy boxes of orcs & goblins, and so on?
A: They struggle with that every year, but probably not because of the SKU issues. Distributors also don't want to distribute that sort of pack. But they may try a few more scenario packages (like the Drizzt pack) in the future. And WotC recognizes the secondary market as a way to meet the need.

Q: Might there be more than 60 All Star cards in the future? We want to use all our old minis.
A: No firm plans yet. But they've discussed various options, including rotating figures in & out of the 60 figure set, and so on. Depending on feedback to the All Star sets, who knows what might happen. Possibly also bring old minis into new sets, so you can continue to use the old sculpt. But, in order to keep new players coming into the game, there is some amount of need to not support very old sets. In a perfect world, they'd make all minis usable. However, if all old minis stay usable forever, new players might be unable to get minis they need for competitive play. Plus there are the obvious resource design constraints. They're pretty sure they're never going to re stat all the old minis.

Q: Any plans to change the distribution?
A: Same rare/uncommon/common breakdown.

Q: Is the new game compatible with the current game?
A: No, the skirmish stats don't directly translate from the old to the new. The ones that don't have All Star stats won't be usable in the new skirmish game.

Q: When will the qualifiers start running the new system?
A: It sounds like the 2008 qualifiers will use the new sets.

Q: Icingdeath set and stuff like that: Will those be updated?
A: All the Icons will be updated.

Q: What about Chainmail proxies in the new game?
A: Not sure, but it makes a kind of sense. They like the idea of potentially using all four drow chainmail sculpts as the one Drow DDM 2.0 creature that was thrown out there.

Q: Can you release downloadable old stat cards for the new sets that come with the stat cards?
A: No. They don't have the resources, and they want to design for the new game. (Not the old game.) But they have no objection to fans of the old game carrying the banner of the old game, putting DDM 1.0 stats out there for DDM 2.0 creatures, and so on.

Q: What kind of metagame should we expect in the future? What's the deal with not all minis being playable? What's the deal with the apparent power creep? Do you have any idea what percentage of minis people use in competitive play?
A: There are a lot of minis that people use when testing competitive warbands that don't ultimately show up in top level competitive play, but they *do* show up, and that's good. They feel that DDM is one of the most diverse CMGs, and that's a good thing. They want any given mini to have a moment in the sun, with rays of sunshine occasionally shining down on it later. R&D values diversity, and they know it's something players value. Ultimately its the players that determine what warbands show up.

Q: Is there still a 8 activation limit.
A: 10 minis as a standard, and it should still fit in a 1-hour format.

Q: What about those of us that want to play the goblin horde and radically break the 10 mini limit?
A: It's a challenge to make the small creatures meaningful on the battlefield, given breath weapons, and so on. But costing in the last 6 sets has really helped them go forward with the new game. The relative costs of creatures of disparate levels will be reasonable and meaningful such that two 20 point minis can - in theory - be an even battle with the single 40 point mini.

Q: Map initiative & Map distribution?
A: Initiative is still a d20 roll. The player with the highest champion rolls two dice and takes the best of them. The maps might be brought forward into the game (no plans to announce, but there was some suggestion that *some* current maps will be brought forward), but you'll have to ignore things like exit squares. (There are fear effects, but they don't make you run toward the exits.) Victory areas and start areas are still relevant. Still looking at ways to distribute maps other than in starters: Possibly organized play, possibly on the backs of set posters (lots of applause), possibly put maps into the D&D products. But they don't want to make an adventure map with lots of skirmish details getting in the way.

Q: Are you reducing the randomness?
A: They think the game is a little less swingy.

Q: Will there be odd speeds? Even speeds with double moves limit the tactical choices.
A: They want more speeds to be closer to 6, which means a lot of 7s and 5s.

Q: DCI ratings: Will the system change? Will we be getting new ratings?
A: Ian is a big proponent of erosive systems. A lot of folks ask for the Dreamblade system, which is pretty good but has difficulties which the player base might not be aware of. If they reset, you won't lose your ranking.

Q: Might there be "Classic" 200 point competitions?
A: Yes, they're talking about that.

Q: When will Michael Derry's Championship miniature be availble?
A: There will be more details about this in the coming weeks. Shoe and Derry just talked about that earlier in Gen Con.

Q: Huges: Will they be coming out? Will there be All Star huges? Future Huge sets?
A: Yes. Maybe. Yes. The July 2008 set is the first 4th Edition huge set, with the Giant theme. 60 mini set in total, with 12 huges, but slightly different c/u/r distribution than we're expecting.

Q: What about synergies between Dwarves with Phalanx Fighting and stuff like that? Will those things still exist?
A: Yes, through the use of keywords (Wizard, Good, Evil, etc.), there will be ways to encourage certain kinds of warband configurations and synergies.

Q: How do the skirmish players influence the design? What percentage of the product is being bought strictly for skirmish?
A: About 1/3 of the players play the skirmish game. But it's muddy because plenty of people overlap into roleplaying and collecting. Roleplayers are at least 2/3 or 3/4 because of the overlap. They do respect how vocal the skirmishers are. They listen to the skirmishers' feedback. But there always will be some minis that are designed primarily for the rpg.

Q: For minis with normal and epic cards, will the All Star version have both cards?
A: Haven't figured that out yet.

Q: Summoners: Will they be more than points on a stick?
A: Rob: "I believe at this time, I will not answer your question DDM 2.0 News!!!!! Smile" (laughter.)

Q: Will theme warbands be more viable? This helps roleplayers transition into the skirmish game.
A: New Faction system is designed to promote certain themes. By doing so many good miniatures in the skirmish game, the roleplayers are itching to kill the good minis. In 4th Ed, good creatures do fight each other and have conflict. The skirmish miniatures pushed them in that direction.

Q: You have Good & Evil. Are there Law & Chaos too?
A: Law and Chaos could be keywords, but not factions.

Q: Is there a loose point formula/system for DDM, and can you put it in an article for converting from the rpg?
A: Coming up with a tool to do that (admittedly imperfectly) is certainly something to think about. They do enjoy writing the Design & Development articles.

Q: Will Huges be legal creatures in 200 and 100 point play? Like the Treant & Bulette.
A: It would be a lot easier to do that in the new game. They will have to take a look at that. Bill has pushed R&D to make huges that are not just epic.

Q: Will there be scenarios other than Assault? Roll for scenario?
A: They haven't been spending their design time making new scenarios. There might be some minor tweaks. Different scenarios actually make it harder for a player base to find one another. Once the player base grows, then the number of formats & scenarios can grow. Organized play likes promoting new scenarios for non-tournament (casual) play.

Q: Still three sets next year: April / July / Nov?
A: Yes.

Q: Will 2008 Champs be 200 or 500?
A: 200.

Q: Will 2008 Sealed Qualifiers doing 200 or 500?
A: No answer. Still has to be planned.

Q: What are the internal numbers for the new set? Do they restart at 1, or are we going to 15, 16, and so on.
A: For now, they're sticking with 15, 16, and so on for the new sets.

Q: When can we buy Orcus?
A: Andy Collins asked how much we would pay for it. (Varied responses, obviously.) They're optimistic to be able to make Orcus, but they're not sure when or how yet. It's not in the catalog yet. They made the prototype to start convincing business & sales teams and distributors that it is a cool, viable mini.

Q: The Large Red Dragon paint was somewhat disappointing.
A: They learned a lot with that process, and some things didn't come out as perfectly as they wanted. They try to apply these lessons to the other Icons.

Q: What about a change in the targeting rules?
A: It will be clear in each ranged power whether you have to target the nearest enemy, or whatever. (Shoe let slip that you can use ranged attacks while adjacent.)

Q: If there was no firm plan for Orcus, why was it on Amazon?
A: That item is going to be taken down.

Q: Will there be a Gargantuan Green? Are the rumors of a signed Bloodbane true?
A: No plans to talk about. Those products sound like cool, reasonable ideas. They are talking about Dragonlance for the 25th anniversary in 2009. They will be looking very closely at how Icingdeath does in the market. They'd like to make the gargantuan release a yearly standard, but it isn't actually a standard.

Q: For All Star voting, what happens if we all vote for an old mini when that mini eventually comes out in a new set?
A: They can look at that in the future, and maybe a new mini gets added to the All Star lineup to replace it.

Q: Will there be a way to limit voting for All Stars to only the competitive players?
A: That's hard to limit. (Though the audience threw out the suggestion for using DCI numbers.)

Q: Any plans for Tarrasque?
A: Lots of people have asked for that.

Q: Is the Icon line viable? Is there a possibility that it might not continue.
A: We'd like it to do better. Buy Icingdeath.

Q: Is there any chance of Icons that aren't gargantuan or colossal?
A: That's certainly a possibility. (See the Battle of Endor pack for Star Wars Minis. Also the upcoming Hoth pack.)

Q: Will you be increasing prize support in small/local tournaments?
A: Ian says they will be trying to do twice as many prereleases. Continuing to support release tournaments. They're trying to upgrade the things they are officially supporting right now, but there are no plans to offer new prize support for local stores' tuesday night normal DDM tournaments.

Q: How will All Star minis translate?
A: They will try to make them similar in purposes to their original versions.


Taken from Guy Fullerton's Gen Con Report.
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ZER0
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 3:03 pm

My comment, I *really* like the way this sounds after hearing a bit more of the rules. And the fact that we're getting 60 of everyone's favorite/most competitive cards re-statted for 4th ed, at least. A huge set next year (starring GIANTS!!!) All kinds of goodness. I'm freaking happy. We'll see how it plays soon enough, and then I can make a full-on decision whether or not I'll play. But so far, I'm still buying DoD1, and singles from later minis sets (maybe make my own stat cards, etc.). Anyone else like the idea that qualifiers are like 2-3 months after the new product releases? Oh, and ranged in melee!! Hell yeah!!!
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<b>View of DDM 2.0</b> : DDM 2.0 News!!!!! Woot10
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 3:25 pm

There is much to contemplate in there. Some earlier questions have been answered.

But, to be honest, most of it doesn't fill me with positive notions about the future of the DDM line.
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 3:35 pm

They said there will probably still be "classic" tourneys, so even competitive skirmish isn't really taking a hit here.
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 6:04 pm

Yeah, but for how long? Six months? A year? Longer? Or will it be a "special event" something to help promote a con? D&D XP 2008 Featuring a rare Harbinger/Deathknell Skirmish round!

Sad
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PostSubject: Re: DDM 2.0 News!!!!!   DDM 2.0 News!!!!! EmptySat Aug 18, 2007 11:33 pm

Well, at random a company can destroy a game, without warning. At least this way you know competitive games will continue for a little while. And, a new game is coming out to replace the old one that works kind of the same way. No company is indestructable, I got into minis with the mindset it might go under at any minute (had games cancel on me right at the peak of my interest before) and still enjoyed them up until now. Maybe that's why I'm taking the switch easier.
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